SAGE 2023 - Demo Heroes Origins (SAGE '23 Sonic Demo)

DaBigJ · Sep 1, 2023

How do I download games on this site??

Linky439 · Sep 2, 2023

That is quite an impressive engine you got here. The basics seem to be working fine, and that's never a given especially with loopings and such. Just for info, 16-bit characters cannot break the small monitors ^^
I am looking forward to the full game ! I have never played the titles you mention so I'd probably go blind in a lot of these stages. But make sure your scope doesn't go overboard ;)

SamuelVictor · Sep 2, 2023

Linky439 said:
That is quite an impressive engine you got here. The basics seem to be working fine, and that's never a given especially with loopings and such. Just for info, 16-bit characters cannot break the small monitors ^^
I am looking forward to the full game ! I have never played the titles you mention so I'd probably go blind in a lot of these stages. But make sure your scope doesn't go overboard ;)

Thank you so much!

The engine is very feature filled, its actually built for a Metroidvania game with lots of "non Sonic" features, like inventory, skill trees, animated cutscenes, top down map, etc. but I wanted the platforming movement to be like Sonic, so I figured as I'm a huge fan, why not also use it to make a Sonic game for the community and to show my love for these old titles? As you said, the loops and mobius strips were the biggest stumbling block, but they are working quite well now - pipes were a similar problem but again I have them working in other levels.

I have the 16bit characters working perfectly in 16bit levels (I have Green Hill, Emerald Hill and 2 Chaotix Levels made, but I didn't include them in the public version yet as they cause a memory hole bug for some people. I'm working to fix that in the next few days - I really want all styles available for people to try and bugtest by the end of SAGE.

But as you noticed - they currently clip through the 8bit monitors - I think this must be to do with how I programmed the code that makes them a solid object (so you colide with them) and only break when you are spinning. Thats a very helpful comment, and I'll work on fixing that ASAP thank you!

I've also noticed that some of the 8bit characters keep turning into 16bit Amy or Tails when they do certain moves - again, thats caused by me combining the code for the 16bit and 8bit characters, which I only did hastily to put this demo together in time for the deadline. I'll fix this as soon as I can - of course in the finished game, usually you'd only want the 16bit characters in 16bit levels, and 8bit in 8bit levels, because the size difference makes the jumps too easy/hard - but I think I'll get them all workign in both because it will be a fun thing to put as an unlocable feature for people to play with and "break" the game after they finished it properly

Thanks again for takign time to leave such a kind and helpful comment. I'll be sure not to go too overboard - I've a pretty clear idea of what I want to eventually achieve with this, and what the "end point" is - however, I'm very realistic about how long that could take, and I'm not putting pressure on myself to "crunch". Hopefully buy SAGE next year it will be ready - or at least far more substantial than this current demo!

SamuelVictor · Sep 2, 2023

DaBigJ said:
How do I download games on this site??

The links to Zip files are in the column on the right of each showcase page. Have fun!

Linky439 · Sep 2, 2023

SamuelVictor said:
Thank you so much! The engine is very feature filled, its actually built for a Metroidvania game with lots of "non Sonic" features, like inventory, skill trees, animated cutscenes, top down map, etc. but I wanted the platforming movement to be like Sonic, so I figured as I'm a huge fan, why not also use it to make a Sonic game for the community and to show my love for these old titles?

Oh, impressive! It could make a fun engine to use for any future project you may have then! :)

SamuelVictor said:
I've also noticed that some of the 8bit characters keep turning into 16bit Amy or Tails when they do certain moves - again, thats caused by me combining the code for the 16bit and 8bit characters, which I only did hastily to put this demo together in time for the deadline. I'll fix this as soon as I can - of course in the finished game, usually you'd only want the 16bit characters in 16bit levels, and 8bit in 8bit levels, because the size difference makes the jumps too easy/hard - but I think I'll get them all workign in both because it will be a fun thing to put as an unlocable feature for people to play with and "break" the game after they finished it properly

Ah yes, when trying to push monitors 8-bit Tails and Knuckles turned 16-bits, and Vector morphed into Amy a couple of times (when spindashing for instance)

Maybe that is his non-canon detective superpower...

(It would come in handy to be able to morph into someone else for such a job!) I also found that pressing the Start button would sometimes "skip" a menu screen (like from Title Screen almost immediately to Green Hill or selecting the "Quit Game" option, as if the game kept taking into account that I pressed the button on more than one frame)

Good luck on this project! I'll come back to check the final version of the demo at the end of SAGE :)

SamuelVictor · Sep 2, 2023

Linky439 said:
Oh, impressive! It could make a fun engine to use for any future project you may have then! :)

Thank you! Yes, I originally started writing a Sonic engine for fun, but then during lockdowns, myself and Blue Lavander decided to use the time to design an original game, character, world etc. She's a little Witch called Hazel, and she drinks coffee for powerups, so that's why I called the engine Hazelnut Café! Its actually being used for 4 commercial console+Steam games and I'll be making it available for others, but also once its finished I want to make it free for the Sonic fangame community to use

Linky439 said:
Ah yes, when trying to push monitors 8-bit Tails and Knuckles turned 16-bits, and Vector morphed into Amy a couple of times (when spindashing for instance) Maybe that is his non-canon detective superpower... (It would come in handy to be able to morph into someone else for such a job!)

Haha yes I noticed these kinds of glitches - its very annoying to me because it works 100% perfectly when using the "right" characters in the "right" levels but when trying to rush to make a public demowhere people could try them all, it got messed up because the code for each character interferes with itself. I know how to fix this, and it will be sorted soon.

Linky439 said:
I also found that pressing the Start button would sometimes "skip" a menu screen (like from Title Screen almost immediately to Green Hill or selecting the "Quit Game" option, as if the game kept taking into account that I pressed the button on more than one frame)

That's very useful to know - I saw someone else on a stream having a similar problem. Can I ask what type of pad you were using? If its a generic PC one rather than a specific console's pad, is it Direct input or Xinput? I think I know whats causing this, but for maximum compatibility I'm going to buy as many different standard console and PC pads as I can and make a robust code to handle it all - as well key mapping and reconfigurable controls in the options menu, which I'm going to try and get done asap.

Linky439 said:
Good luck on this project! I'll come back to check the final version of the demo at the end of SAGE :)

Thank you so much! I really appreciate your feedback, very helpful and encouraging too.

Linky439 · Sep 2, 2023

SamuelVictor said:
Thank you! Yes, I originally started writing a Sonic engine for fun, but then during lockdowns, myself and Blue Lavander decided to use the time to design an original game, character, world etc. She's a little Witch called Hazel, and she drinks coffee for powerups, so that's why I called the engine Hazelnut Café! Its actually being used for 4 commercial console+Steam games and I'll be making it available for others, but also once its finished I want to make it free for the Sonic fangame community to use

That sounds nice! Is there a place to follow updates and those games? I tried my luck with The Timeless Adventures of Hazel Witch but couldn't find anything ^^

SamuelVictor said:
That's very useful to know - I saw someone else on a stream havign a similar problem. Can I ask what type of pad you were using? If its a generic PC one rather than a specific console's pad, is it Direct input or Xinput? I think I know whats causing this, but for maximum compatibility I'm going to buy as many different standard console and PC pads as I can and make a robust code to handle it all - as well key mapping and reconfigurable controls in the options menu, which I'm going to try and get done asap.

I am using an X360 controler for PC on Windows 10, so I guess it is Xinput by default?

SamuelVictor said:
Thank you so much! I really appreciate your feedback, very helpful and encouraging too.

No problem! :) I feel fan events such as SAGE are made to help out each other so I'm happy if my feedback is of any use!

SamuelVictor · Sep 2, 2023

Linky439 said:
That sounds nice! Is there a place to follow updates and those games? I tried my luck with The Timeless Adventures of Hazel Witch but couldn't find anything ^^

Thanks! I'll be uploading trailers and development progress of all of my games on my YouTube channel, I just set up a new one specifically for the engine, will be posting the first video in a few hours, I'm editing it now

I'm also on Twitter/X as samuelvictor though right now I'm taking a mental health break from social media. I'm a movie producer & actor and recently did an AMA about my time on Star Wars and it went crazy viral and I've been doing lots of interviews and public appearances recently both at Star Wars events (including Celebration, which was CRAZY) and for my autobiography, and soon will be doing the ComicCon circles for an upcoming superhero movie so I mostly stay off social media as my anxiety is somewhat peaked by the sudden exposure!

Linky439 said:
I am using an X360 controler for PC on Windows 10, so I guess it is Xinput by default?

Excellent, thank you. I have a wired 360 controller, and a wireless Xbox One pad so I can test both and debug things.

Linky439 said:
No problem! :) I feel fan events such as SAGE are made to help out each other so I'm happy if my feedback is of any use!

Absolutely! Really helpful and encouraging, thank you! I have a hard time being online sometimes, because my job brings out the trolls. Thats also why I'm not really keen on promoting it via my Twitter right now! Perhaps I'll start a specific games related one. But a specific small niche place like this for people with a shared interest is a space space, of sorts. Sonic fans are my people! (also Star Wars fans! I had nothing but love at Celebration, which considering the size of the event was wonderful).

GamerDomCool · Sep 3, 2023

wow, i feel like this is one of the best games this sage. i really like the intro, the gameplay is pretty good, and you are absolutely spittin' bars in that rap. one problem though, it seems like the lyrics don't appear in the newest version. anyway, this is great. looking forward to the full release.

SamuelVictor · Sep 3, 2023

GamerDomCool said:
wow, i feel like this is one of the best games this sage. i really like the intro, the gameplay is pretty good, and you are absolutely spittin' bars in that rap. one problem though, it seems like the lyrics don't appear in the newest version. anyway, this is great. looking forward to the full release.

Woah, what a great comment, thank you so much! So many incredible entries to SAGE this year so I take that as a huge complement!

Thank you for the kind words on the intro! I'm aware that this demo is currently only 2 levels of gameplay (more being added soon, I have them made but need to bugfix some gimmicks to make tehm stable) and is somewhat unfinished so people may wonder why I'm making such a flashy introduction - presentation/style and representation of Sega and Sonic history is a huge part of my motivation for making this project - the eventual final version will have extremely flashy and fully filled menus, options, variety in game modes, customisation of sprites, game styles etc to cover the full history of Sonic and cater to all Sonic fans differing tastes, so its important to me for the introduction to really set that up with as many references, easter eggs etc as possible.

For the missing lyrics, I assume you mean the Sonic Heroes ones? Well spotted! I did that on purpose because what I'm planning is to have the intro / attract sequence to have some easter egg style variety - the first time its vanilla, then the second time, its got the Karaoke lyrics, and little additions and changes - for example the Sonic singing sprite from the Master System game will appear on screen, the Mega CD on the title screen will have its Japanese Karaoke attachment, Knuckles will have his hat, some of the logos will switch to more obscure varieties that people may have nostalgia for - Nomad, Mega PC, Genesis 3, Multimega, Wondermega, etc. I'll also add "Karaoke Mode" as an unlockable extra so people can skip straight to watching it, and of course put a full version of the complete intro and Karaoke version on my YouTube channel.

If instead you meant the lyrics for the rap are no longer showing, again, this is a work in progress feature where I'm making an in-engine music/lyrics video. Right now, it shows videoclips in a Mega-CD low bitrate version, in a Sonic CD style frame during the instrumental parts, but when I'm rapping, the intention is to have the lyrics on screen, along with pictures/sprite animations for all the different things from Sega history that I'm referencing. Right now, it just shows the videoclips and perhaps the bare lyrics, I can't remember if diasbling Karaoke mode also disabled the rap lyrics. I hope to have this music video finished within a day or two. Again, it will appear if you leave it on the attract screen long enough, and will also be an unlockable extra and on my YouTube.

And thank you so much for complementing the rap!

I had so much fun doing that - I was somewhat selfconscious about adding it but its such a fun tribute to the time and once the idea popped into my head when seeing the FFF commercial I just had to go with it! Many years ago, I was in the music industry and used to ghost write lyrics for quite a few big name American rappers, and I openly worked with people including D12, T Pain, Akon, R Kelly and others. That was many year ago but this is a nostalgic project for me so it was fun to rap again!

Mariosonicman22 · Apr 1, 2024

Wow, this is super ambitious! Good luck! If this is finished, it'll be one of the all-time greats! Up there with the up-and-coming Sonic Studios, Sonic Triple Trouble 16-bit, and Sonic and the Fallen Star!
Also, does no one else think its super weird you have to jump to do a hammer dash with Amy? I suggest making a peel-out kind of thing and giving her a buffed double jump/insta shield, and also removing the insta shield from Sonic.

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SAGE 2023 - Demo Heroes Origins (SAGE '23 Sonic Demo)

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